Initially I wanted to ask a bid related question about FB first, but decided to turn this into a follow along maybe and get this actually really going.
Facebook – Dating
Offer: Fortyplussingles.com (Direct Linking)
Target: Male / Single or not specified / interested in women
Profit/Loss: $15.00 (LOSS)
Cost: $23.86 (day not full complete yet)
Profit/Loss: $13.86 (LOSS)
Questions: So, I am trying to better understand FB pricing, CPC, and how that exactly works. I am bidding into the middle of the suggested range. I understand that my CPC depends on the CTR. How fast would I see the CPC prices go down in general and when do I know that I reached the bottom?
What do I do with my bid? Do I slowly adjust downwards or leave it where it is and let FB take care of the CPC?
I need to test more ads. Do I create more campaigns or add the new ads into the existing ones?
I don’t know about CPC in canada but that’s a pretty high bid in my opinion mate.
And yes you can still improve you ctr%; roi% is not horrible so keep testing !
Your bids are a little high you need to work on CTR….. .2 CTr is only okay these days
In France I had a .5 CTR and I was losing money with the best performing dating offer on my networks
Today my CTR reached above 1.2% and my profit was barely at 100% ROI on a super low scale… If you can profit at this time of year then I think after January you will be balling…. Since it’s the end of the year the prices are sky high which makes it super hard to scale and get cheap clicks.
Thanks guys. Do I add more ads into the same campaign or secondary campaign. I think I’ve read something to leave certain campaigns separate because FB usually picks only 1 ad and sends all the traffic to it. Or am I on the wrong track with that?
Nope you’re right, FB will quickly pick one ad that get’s the best ctr% after a low amount of clics and start only showing this one.
So for a proper split test you need to create one campaign per variation/ad/pic.
It’s completely unergonomic but that’s just the way it is with Facebook.
You need images with over 0.2 CTR, so your CPC will drop below $0.10
Interesting day today. I assume weekends on Facebook are similar to weekends on POF with slightly higher conversion rates. I created a second campaign with 2 ads, but only 1 ad went active while the second one is still shown as pending. I also paused 2 ads from the first campaign and only had the 3rd one active that did not get any traffic on the days before. That ad actually scored a 0.364% CTR, but still fairly high CPC. So, I had a total of 2 active ads today and scored a total of 8 conversions. The one active ad in the new campaign 40+Date5 scored a CTR of 0.166% and was responsible for 5 conversions.
Cost: $37.00 ($12 in campaign #1 and $25.00 in campaign #2 (rounded up since budget is almost used))
Profit/Loss: $3.00 (Profit)
So, for tomorrow I hope that the pending ad becomes active. If it does not I will create a new campaign and duplicate it over.
Not sure what to do with the ad "40+Date1". It has a high CTR, but not that many conversions + the CPC is still very high. What would you guys recommend doing? Pausing it and move it into a new campaign since it was the "red-headed step child" in that campaign that did not get traffic the days before?!
My account is still limited to the default daily spend, so I think I am restricted with how many additional campaigns to create. Any suggestions on how to move forward?
Split test a landing page?
Probably will, but first want to get some ads/images stabilized.
Just received an email that my account has been upgraded to $250/day spending limit. I take that as a good sign.
I am still only running on 2 ads at the same time (mainly from a cash-flow perspective, but will add a 3rd one tomorrow). The one pending ad never became active and so I killed it and moved it into its own campaign. Waiting for approval again. I also took one of the very first ads that had a ~0.16% CTR and moved it into its own campaign. I had it paused due to the other ad having the high CTR. Further down below I will talk about an ad that sits just below 0.150% CTR, but converts really well even at that level. So, I want to test one of the earlier ads as described because it actually seemed to convert Ok (=meaning, it could be slightly profitable).
AD40+Date1: The ad with the highest CTR is finally getting lower CPCs, but is lacking conversions. 2 Conversions for the day on $12 spent on FB. Not sure does it make sense to bump up the daily spent or is the image just too much of a teaser maybe that will simply not convert? Kill it?
AD40+Date5: The ad shows a CTR of 0.144% which seems low, but it converts quite well. At the time of this writing I did spend $24.44 on this ad and have $35.00 in revenue. Not sure how to proceed? Test a different ad text with the same image? Or lower the CPC slightly and see if it becomes more profitable at the lower CPC?
I have 2 more ads waiting to be approved (separate campaign). And I mentioned that earlier my account has been upgraded to $250 daily ad spend. Trying to spend more, but also need to keep an eye on my cash-flow. While I have some room to wiggle, the funds can be blown fast apparently.
Cost: $35.65 (Day is still going | Campaign #1 = $10.43 + Campaign #2 = $24.22)
Profit/Loss: $10.35 (Profit)
You’re in a pretty nice situation there – one image converting higher but lower CTR, one lower CTR but converting higher. Why is this good? Because hopefully you’ll be able to get some insight into where the best balance point is at! (assuming here they have the same exact ad copy and have been run in parallel time wise).
If it were me I would do this:
Advert 1 (High CTR, low CVR, ~break even): Duplicate it into new campaigns (never mess with a working advert!) and play with the ad copy. Make 3 campaigns with different ad copy, 3 dupes of each advert, see if they stick with approximately the same CTR as the original and see if they garner a higher backend CTR. Two conversions isn’t enough data to work on so you will need to give them some breathing space and get more data from that original. I would recommend sending more volume to the original advert and seeing how low you can push that CPC – change budget just after your advertising day ticks over, drop bid on that ad to say $0.25 and see how it fares the next day. Since this image is getting higher CTR you are going to get cheaper data with this guy.
Advert 2 (Lowish CTR, higher CVR, decent ROI): So CTR is the main thing holding that advert back. You’re probably not going to get much from lowering the bid on this, it really needs a bit more performance oomph to bring the CPC down. So, duplicate that advert into a new campaign. Let a few of em fly, see if one sticks better. Won’t take long to get below $0.20 if one of them sticks with high CTR for a few hours. After which that ad may start out-performing the original… next, try playing with image borders, saturation etc if that’s what you feel like doing. I would look at advert 1 vs advert 2 and try to test more images in new campaigns, see if you can find some other image that strikes a decent balance between CTR/CVR. The testing from advert 1 should give you guidance as to which ad copy works better.
Cool. Working on that now. Another question – since I am direct linking, should I throw in another dating offer underneath and see if that converts better on the traffic from the high CTR ad? Or is that step the last resort after following your other recommendations?
You have to state the name of the dating site in the ad copy so rotating the offer while direct linking can be dangerous, I would leave that for when you have a lander in the middle. User complaints and FB checking might get your ads retro’d. You could however rotate in a lander that then links out to rotating offers, just be careful with things being red on MyWoT – last thing you want to do is get your account/ads wiped when you’re having initial success and getting experience with the platform.
Valid point. Thanks for pointing that out. Depending on how things go with that one I might create a new campaign instead pointing to a different offer and compare. I’ll update later how things are going today.
Are Mondays (Tuesdays/Wednesdays) slow for dating on FB the same way as they are on POF? What kind of traffic pattern can I expect?
Ah, crap. I am getting a security warning from Facebook due to "unusual payment activity".
We are writing to let you know that there has been irregular login activity on your account. We have investigated your account and believe it has been compromised. The next time you log in, you will notice some steps to help you regain control of your account.
As a result of this suspicious activity, we have disabled your payments functionality in an effort to protect you as well as our other users. This means you are currently not able to make purchases on Facebook. If you would like to reactivate your payments account once you have regained control of your account, please contact us here:
Just filled out the web form with questions/answers and should receive an email from them hopefully soon. Arghhhhhh
What did you do? Log in via proxy?
No, but the office (day job) I work at connects to the Internet through the HQ office in another state. I did login to the account from home and from the office several times already on other days. I guess I have to change it and remote into my computer at home and then login from there. I explained it to them through the web form, but I guess it will take until tomorrow to get this worked out.
You should be fine then, very likely to get it sorted. Be glad it’s not suspicious payments notice where they have linked you to banned accounts. I’ve logged in from all around NZ and from Australia and the US, I figure you get whitelisted after a while. I also log in to my mums account to do stuff for her (she is over in Indonesia/Thailand and all over the place there), got sign in security stuff a few times but all good after a while – not involving any advertising but that lockout is likely just a consequence that follows the normal security measures.
I hope so. It is too early for me to lose an account. Just have to be patient now and to get it back. I wish there would be a phone number to call.
I had 11 conversions today until they shut me down, but cannot see how much I spent. I know I had spent less than what I made. Oh well … hopefully back in business tomorrow.
Still waiting to hear back from Facebook. I wish they had a phone number to call. I am impatient.
Got my account back this evening. All is good, they reviewed all the information I had provided and sent me on my way.
So, here is the data for yesterday. Of course it is skewed due to having my account being locked starting yesterday afternoon.
Profit/Loss: $0.06 (Loss)
I duplicated the ad with the high CTR image and are testing it with some different ad text/headline combination. I also took the image/ad that shows the high conversion rate and are testing it with different ad/headline as well. I also have new images in separate campaigns going. Hard to tell about the profit/loss/revenue numbers from yesterday.
Due to my account being locked for over 24 hours I will not really have good testing data today. I just turned everything back on and I hope each ad and campaign picks up where it left of – meaning, the ads that were sticking are doing so again.
Here is the data from yesterday.
Nice work man, let the data flow…
Pulling the plug on the high CTR image in the new campaign with different ad text (or is this pre-mature?). The ad/campaign "raced" through the budget this evening, but only created one (1) conversion. Here is the data out of Facebook:
I might create a new campaign and throw this image/ad into the mix with a different offer and see if that offer converts better. The current offer is converting good (in my opinion) , just this image/ad combination seems to be stubborn.
What EPC does that correspond to though? If a 2nd conversion suddenly appeared would it make you think twice? In which case, yes, far too early to cull it. Remember your FB ad is new too so you have been paying much higher CPCs than you will over the coming days provided the CTR remains reasonable.
Don’t shrug off the high CTR image yet, perhaps play with the ad text to accommodate the image.
Ok, I restarted the ad with the high CTR image to make sure I am getting enough data. Here is the data for last night. Almost all campaigns used the entire budget in the few being active hours yesterday. Amazing how much traffic there is and how much I usually dont see because of the budget settings.
Profit/Loss: $27.78 (Loss)
The ad generated 7 conversions and came back in with a small profit. My cost per click is too high. Not sure if that is due to the campaigns being paused when my account was under review. I was paying the in the lower $0.20s before. I am inclined to increase the budget on this one a bit more to catch more traffic and of course I hope that the CPC goes down today.
This is a newer ad (new image, same ad text/title) and it started off quite well from a conversion perspective. This ad/campaign is haunted by the same problem I am having with the other one the CTR is fairly low. Since this one is new I assume I am able to get the CPC down a bit and then it should be profitable. Not highly profitable, but at least something. I think for both ads with this problem I have to try harder and find a better ad text/title to increase the CTR.
Ad 40+Date1 and 40+Date10 (high CTR image)
Here is a comparison of using this image in 2 different campaigns yesterday. 40+Date10 is sporting a slightly different ad title/text while 40+Date1 is the original ad unchanged. In one way I think this was a good test yesterday as both campaigns started from scratch due to the account under review. On the other side the original ad shows a significant lower CTR compared to before and I am concerned this is due to the campaign being temporarily paused.
I also did test 2 more ads yesterday, but they both came in with low CTRs and very low conversion rate. I paused those for now to keep the cash-flow under control. I am trying to bring up one new campaign/ad per day and see if I find something that has good CTR and conversions and then slowly expand.
Brutal today. Good amount of clicks, but conversions suck. 4 conversions total so far. 179 clicks. EPC $0.11. Big loss unless something changes dramatically for the last few hours.
As mentioned, yesterday was just brutal. The network EPC was way down. All my campaigns ran out of budget in the evening. I did not do much in regards to optimizing. Click prices went down a bit and so it was frustrating to see the offer not working as before.
Profit/Loss: $56.00 (Loss)
218 Clicks | 5 Conversions | EPC 0.11
I rotated in another network with the same offer into the mix to split test and see if the offer converts better through another network.
I brought up a new campaign in a different country. I am using a landing page and it is a different offer. So far this is looking very promising with $25 Cost and $20 revenue – especially since it takes a bit for the cost per click to go down. Those numbers are not included in my profit/lost numbers mentioned for yesterday.
This is not going well. The offer pretty stopped converting for me.
Profit/Loss: $55.82 (Loss)
I have reduced my budget to like $1.50 per day – trying to wait this out maybe and "re-grouping". Also building landing pages for 2 offers.
I assume traffic around the holiday will be different, but since I have been still a lot of clicks I think the problem is at the offer level. I did reach out to my AM asking how the offer is doing on the network level, but my message kept unanswered.
You’ll get cheaper clicks come Jan 1st most likely, and it would be a good idea to hassle your AM for a response if CVR has suddenly dropped (and has been that way for more than a day).
Profit/Loss: $46.03 (Loss)
Ok, did some day-parting on 3 campaigns and the results actually turned out good.
Profit/Loss: $12.18 (Profit)
Today is the 23rd and I am almost out of day-parted budget. Will post those results tomorrow, but roughly breaking even/minor loss. Will set budget to minimum amount for the next 2-3 days and slowly work my way back towards the 1st of the year. Doing a lot of spying/research and collecting images and ad ideas.
congrat ! keep on the great work
Delayed reporting from my side due to holiday:
Profit/Loss: $4.01 (LOSS)
And Christmas Eve actually wasn’t too shabby.
Profit/Loss: $16.80 (Profit)
I have ads running with minimum budget today. Looks like I am going to have a loss coming for today in the single digits, which is fine. I will probably turn on one campaign tomorrow to see how traffic is behaving and then see. Not expecting too much for the next few days. That gives me time to work on landers, spying, and strategy (and of course reading older threads here at STM).
Here is the difference in epc between the 2 offers I am running. Initially I thought the first offer was working great, but I went back through the data and overall the epc never even came close to the second offer. Keep in mind that the second offer is in the mix just a few days and every day it ran it out-performed the first offer dramatically. I know I will need much more traffic volume to see if it holds up, but the overall trend is hopefully showing me the way.
I am going back and stop driving direct-link traffic to the first offer and switch it to the second offer (with landing page).
I know you mentioned about the sample size being small for the second offer, but it’s completely useless as it’s based on around 2.9% of the total volume of your first offer. There’s no way to judge after 43 clicks and roughly 45% CR for an offer. EPC for that second offer is unreal high in my opinion and I almost guarantee it won’t stay that high.
Get at least a reasonable number for the second offer (thinking about 300 clicks or so) before comparing it to the first one.
Profit/Loss: $1.65 (LOSS)
I know yesterday’s numbers don’t mean anything really, but posting them anyway. All campaigns running on a barebone budget yesterday.
@fjk87 – gotcha. I know my math is a bit flawed from what I posted. Problem is that the offer stopped converting several days ago. For now I will leave those campaigns on bare-bone budget. I duplicated the 2 best ads into 2 new campaigns and switched the offer underneath (ad->landing page-> second offer). The second offer is converting and so I am hoping to ride things out. Also have another email in to my aff manager at WSM hoping to find out details about network wide performance of the first offer.
Profit/Loss: $7.30 (PROFIT)
Still running on smaller budget settings. Ran 1 campaign on an increased budget starting late afternoon to see if evening traffic would convert, but blew through the money fast without getting much in return.
Keep going… following you bigbyte
Here is yesterday’s data.
Profit/Loss: $48.59 (PROFIT)
After analyzing data and looking at my stats I decided to increase the budget on one of my campaigns (single ad). Conversions seemed steady and so I wanted to see what would happen if I increase the budget and therefore the exposure. Starting at around 6.30 PM MST I increased the daily budget from the barebone value I had set to $15.00. Traffic started flowing and so did conversions. After refreshing my stats screen way too often I increased the budget by $15 to $30 and the same thing happened. Traffic and conversions came in “orderly fashion”. I continued to monitor my data, revenue, and spending and went on to increase the budget.
Ad Data CPVLAB
Revenue Data from affiliate network
I had other campaigns and ads go online yesterday and was in the hole a bit. In the end this one ad pulled me out of the hole and helped to generate the profit you see above. The ad is responsible for $130.00 of the $175.00 revenue. I am linking to a landing page and from there to the dating offer.
I had started to US dating campaigns – limiting it to a single year of age. Those 2 campaigns raced through their budget as if there would be no tomorrow. I slightly broke even on those, but the CTR is not convincing me yet to keep them for now. I am realizing to test US traffic I need more cash and I think right now I am probably more comfortable going international.
In other discussions here it has been said that the Facebook CPCs are high due to large companies and brands driving up prices (holidays) and that prices should adjust early January. If that is really the case I should be able to be more profitable and stable profitable. It’s still a bit scary to up the budget and to spent the money I have been spending.
As mentioned I am doing a lot of competitive research and are testing things each day. If an ad shows potential I continue testing, but I am also quick on pulling the trigger and kill a campaign if the CTR is too far down. A lot of my losses shown here are based on that = stuff not necessarily working out.
I emailed my affiliate manager again about the one offer that work Ok for a while. I still have not gotten a response and so do not know if the network EPC is reflecting of what I am experiencing. Not very impressed with the affiliate manager yet.
Awesome stuff, the profit is increasing and you’re gaining valuable info, keep it up!
It’s not only holidays, it’s about the last quarter going on and the final stage of the year. It all sums up. Big agencies / spenders usually put up their volume starting in November from my experience and increase it even more on Christmas time. As agencies often get paid on % of the campaigns, it’s natural for them to hit it as hard as they can while having the big pro of ‘Christmas sales’ as an addition.
December is usually a slow month for some niches on many traffic sources, combined with the rising competition during that time, if you breakeven now I’d be positive towards getting that stuff profitable during January.
Btw. keep the great follow along up, good read you’re bringin in!
nice work buddy. Did’nt get to follow the CPC. Was that left out intentionally?
Well, things did not work the way I was hoping for. I am not that familiar with dating offers on FB yet and I was hoping that FRI, SAT, and Sunday would be the better days for these type of offers, too. But at least in my case yesterday this did not come true. Maybe one of the more experienced folks can help me out and chime if the weekend traffic converts better on FB for dating offers?!
Profit/Loss: $35.94 (Loss)
I did test a few more images and campaigns in the US and a the majority of the losses is coming from these tests. CTRs were simply bad even though images and ad texts/titles were seen during competitive research. I tried some existing stuff, but also made my own variations with no luck.
The ad/campaign that did so well on 12/27/2012 created a small profit, but overall under-performed dramatically compared to before. I pushed my budget for that campaign to $85/day, but I was in the red with this campaign until late evening when a handful of final conversions made this campaign profitable. But the overall damage was done and so the day for me ended in the red. Here is the result just for this one campaign/ad.
Screenshot Facebook for this campaign
You can see the cost per click on the screenshot and how much I am bidding. Do I need to change something on my bidding? I assume that my CPC is still high as discussed earlier.
Also, the FortyPlusingles.com offer completely stopped converting now for me. Is anyone else running it? How is it going for you with that offer (feel free to PM if you do not want to reply in public / I definitely will treat info confidentially). I built a landing page for another 40+ offer and will bring up ads/campaigns with that and see how that goes.
So, yesterday was a bit better, but I also ran lower volume. Conversions picked up between 8 PM and 10 PM MST, but dropped after 10 PM. I did some manual day-parting and ran campaigns on lower budget during the day. I am not sure if that is the best way of doing it, but after seeing how Friday went I felt this was a better way for now.
Profit/Loss: $13.31 (Profit)
I sorted out some under-performing campaigns and started 2 new ones (approved this morning).
So, as mentioned I am testing and weeding out campaigns and always bring up one or two new campaigns per day hoping to find another nugget. The offer I am currently running is converting in my opinion, so I am concentrating on this offer and find new images and ads that convert. I am also preparing an additional lander, but have yet to fully add it to campaigns.
The end of the year is near and I guess I am feeling that with my traffic and conversions. Lots of clicks, but barely any conversions.
Profit/Loss: $29.58 (LOSS)
I did bring up 2 new campaigns yesterday more in preparation for January than for making money in 2012. The good news is one of the campaigns/ads is doing extremely well in regards to CTR and I am seeing single digit CPCs (all the way down to $0.04). I had 3 conversions on this ad alone yesterday, so I will ramp up traffic after the first of the year and hope to have a real winner at hand.
I have my campaigns running on very low budget settings today and will most likely occure a loss for the day, but that is to be expected. I will not publish a report for 12/31/2012 unless the traffic data shows to be worth it.
I appreciate your input on my follow-along and I am very optimistic for 2013. I definitely see some progress and hopefully can turn this experience into a money maker. Happy New Year, everyone. 🙂
Last day of the year ended with a small profit. 2013 is here. Can’t wait to get these campaigns going full steam
Profit/Loss: $5.80 (Profit)
Hey man, looks like things are progressing well! One thing, day-parting can be tricky. Increasing your budget during the day is often a bad idea – you tend to get a surge of crappy quality traffic as FB throws volume at your ads to reach your budget-dictated delivery ‘quota’. If you do this, watch CTRs/CPCs/CVR and make sure you’re not suffering. Day-parting over different days of the week is much easier as you can just increase campaign budgets at 12:01 AM.
Hopefully you will get lower CPCs now that Q4 is over. Push that advert that’s getting you low CPCs – make new campaigns, tweak the image a little, adjust the copy, etc. All the while if the original is performing well keep the volume up, cap the CPC and milk it while you can.
Thanks, Zeno. I really appreciate your help. I will ramp up the budget settings slowly following your advice. Here is the data for yesterday. Made only minor adjustments to budget and bid settings. I have 2 campaigns where the CTR is above 0.3% or even above 0.4% – CPCs are definitely going down and I am slowly trimming my bids down as well. Updated the budget, too. Not sure how much to push the budget up want to make sure that conversions are following the cost so that I do not kill myself.
Profit/Loss: $0.70 (LOSS)
I have been mainly concentrating on Canada and the US so far (well, Canada is seeing 90% of my efforts at the moment). All offers are "mature/40+ related". I am wondering if some of my conversion issues are based on the age group I am after?! I have good and bad days naturally, but do I limit myself too much here?
And one more question. One of the campaigns that I am running for over a week shows a great CTR, but the CPC is barely going down. Am I sending not enough clicks? This is US traffic and part of it is probably the holiday season spending issue of large advertisers that we talk about, but in other campaigns my cost per click goes down much faster.
I would send more daily clicks and slowly drop the bid a bit more. FB’s algorithm generally drops CPC on high CTR ads more effectively when they get a steady stream of clicks per hour. From what I have seen, if you have sporadic clicks then it tends to break the downhill slope. e.g. you might want at least 10 clicks an hour to give FB the history data it needs to drop them CPCs. Experiment with one campaign first and see if you can get it to go down. Also, be aware competition may be the problem, so getting new, higher CTR ads and throwing volume at them is the way to win.
I increased the budget on that one campaign, but not sure if that will do the trick. I am wondering to kill the campaign and recreate it to see if that sticks. Here is a screenshot from this morning (a few minutes ago). The actual reach looks pathetic. Or bump up the budget again? My bid is in the middle of the suggested range.
Nice CTR, I imagine the bid must be holding it back a bit at this stage. See how increments in bid affect the traffic. If it’s not bleeding money think of it as a testing ground to get some insight into how to game the FB platform.
Alright. Let’s try it. I just increased the bid by 10 cents.
Ok, and here is the update on yesterday’s outcome:
Slowly increased the budgets on certain campaigns yesterday. Increase in traffic, increase in revenue, and increase in conversion. Still ended up in the red though.
Profit/Loss: $9.61 (Loss)
One campaign that was doing good before is slowly seeing a decrease in CTR and conversions. It was responsible for $25 spent yesterday and did bring in only 1 conversion at $5.00. Before that it was slightly ROI positive/break-even. I’ll let it run for one more day and then kill. This specific one has not been discussed in detail here.
I took the high CTR image and modified it (higher saturation, applied an angle, modified the background) and brought up 2 new campaigns. We will see how those go. I also brought up another campaign but switched from targeting male traffic to female to make sure I have a good mix at the network/advertiser. At one point I want to ask for a bump and I hope the quality of my traffic will help.
Ok, I don’t get it. I increased the bid to 48 cents. The CTR is still good – not as high as on the screenshot from this morning, but close to 0.4% and the CPC is going up, not down.
Hmm yeah that blows a bit, perhaps you’re dealing with such competition that the CPC isn’t going to get much lower than $0.25 without big time CTRs. Sometimes it’s just a bidding war you can’t win. You’ve got decent CTR ads and that’s one of the hardest things to nail. If the raised bid doesn’t seem to help then lower it down again (in steps) until you’re happy. Then consider playing with ad copy only to see if you can pick up conversion rate and use that to bring things into profit land.
Maybe post your ad copy (but not images) here and get some comments? There are many people here with a lot of experience with converting people on dating offers so you’ll probably get some sound advice. A bump in conversion rate from say 4.5% to 6.0% will make a big difference to your EPCs.
I finally stopped any campaign driving traffic to the FortyPlussingles offer. Ive been running it on 2 networks and the offer has gone to @#$%! for me.
Ok, I took the high CTR ad we talked about in the last few postings and reduced the bid again, but the CPC stayed high. I paused the campaign last night, but took the image and brought it back in a new campaign with a landing page instead of direct linking as done before. There was definitely something weird going on with. My CPC is already lower after running for just 12 hours. Due to this campaign going live last night FB spent my entire budget for the day last night. I got 4 conversions out of it already and pretty much broke even on the new version of this ad/campaign = good. CTR for yesterday was 0.164% – way below of what I had before, but it only ran a few hours yesterday. This morning the CTR is at a whooping 0.94% (yes, that is 0.94%), but I am sure it will even out to something lower later today. So, will let this one run for a bit and see. I have not modified the image or the ad text/title yet.
Yesterday I had mentioned that I had taken a certain image and modified it. Well, the ad/campaign went live yesterday and this has been working out great. 5 conversions already and the CPC is going down. The screenshots show the CPC now at $0.13 for today and it already came down nicely compared to yesterday. I also lowered the bid starting bid was $0.35 and I have it $0.30 for now. I bumped up the budget
I took out 2 other under-performing campaigns yesterday. So, today I have a total of 4 campaigns running 2 of those came online yesterday. Here is the Profit/Loss data from yesterday. Not happy with it. Still came in with a loss. I know there is a lot of testing I am doing and it also has been frustrating to deal with the drop in performance for that fortyplussingles offer that did so well in the first half of December.
Profit/Loss: $20.09 (Loss)
My total spending budget scheduled for today is $120.00. I will probably bring up one more campaign later today, but the day job is keeping me busy.
What offer is that?
This is not going very well. I am not making the progress I was hoping to make.
Profit/Loss: $40.29 (Loss)
I am half-way through today and while I was up $32.00 earlier today things are shifting and now I am just ~$10.00 ahead with the gap getting smaller and smaller by the hour. I did increase the budget on some of the campaigns. The high CTR campaign (US | Male | Mature Dating) that I had paused and duplicated is hovering at a low 0.164% CTR on the new campaign and I am paying too much per click as a result. 8 conversions so far today and a bit in the red for that specific campaign.
Also, it always seems like I am doing better in the first half of the day and then lose it all towards the second half/end of day.
The 2 new campaigns that I brought up yesterday are bringing in a pathetic 0.052% CTR. Those are closed out and a 3rd one is waiting to get traffic now (new images, new ad text). Target: US | Female | 45-50 mature dating offer. These campaigns generated some conversions yesterday, but with the CTR being so low these would have a hard time to turn a profit.
I was hoping to have the male / Canada / mature dating campaigns somewhat profitable at this point, but it is way to inconsistent. The US campaigns are experimental and I am probably stretching my budget a bit with those, but my thought process was to bring those up in parallel and substitute the expenses with some of the profits I would have gotten from Canada.
So, need some advice on where to go from here. Am I better off to start over in a different market? The majority of my campaigns is targeting Canada males in the mature dating niche. The high CTR campaign mentioned is US traffic (male / mature). The 3 new campaigns mentioned above are female / mature dating / US traffic. The budget for the US male campaign is currently at $110/day while all the other ones are in the $15 to $30 range per day.
Stop the US campaign and bring up more Canada campaigns instead?
Or pick a different market and niche altogether and come back to US / CA at a later time?
Try changing the offer in Canada first. If that doesn’t work out, i suggest try a different country but sticking to the same niche.
Thanks for the recommendation. I have inquiries into my affiliate managers to get more data about the different mature dating offers.
Yesterday did not go well and I think it is better to start over in a certain way. The results are so inconsistent and the conversion rates are fluctuating too much on the offers I am promoting + the one offer that did really well in December went to hell and none of the other ones has come close for me. Currently I am at around 0.30% EPC and I am not being profitable. I have some ad combinations with good CTR, but things are failing past that. I think my landing page (profile picture lander) is doing alright. I am seeing 50%-60% CTR to the offer.
Step #1: I am going to abandon the US campaign entirely. The offer(s) have been converting less in the US compared to Canada and testing the US market requires a larger testing budget. While I have some money to spend, with the offers in this segment being so weak for me this is just not a good combination.
Step #2: I am re-evaluating all data I have for Canada. I have 1-2 campaigns that were ROI positive (between 10% and 20%) and I will analyze the data piece by piece and see if I can expand those and improve. Going to test changes to the image and the landing page.
Step #3: I did ask my affiliate manager to break up the offer performance by country as these offers are US, CA, AUS, UK, NZ, IE, but he said they do not have that data yet in their systems. So, I will try these offers in other countries as well and see if it makes sense to go there. As mentioned I also inquired about another mature dating offer (Mate1 40+) and hopefully I get some useful data for that offer. I also reached out to my affiliate manager at EWA (have not used them in a long time) and hopefully I get some useful data and offer recommendations from them.
Step #4: Going International! I am doing some competitive research on dating offers for non-English speaking countries. It looks Be2 is all over the place, but I see a lot of affiliates going directly with the advertiser and my concern is that the payouts I am getting from a normal CPA network will not let me compete just yet. The networks I am working with also have limited availability for some of the countries I am looking and if they have something, some of the payouts are too low ($1 to $2.50 range). Adsimilis declined my application back in October. Have to find other networks I can get into.
I am also always having a bit of a problem with getting a good angle on a generic dating offer. That is a part where I need to learn more.
Ok, any feedback or recommendations you guys have please post them. If I am off the beaten path, kick me I can handle the feedback. I want to make this work. I am not afraid of losing money as you can see from this follow-along. I want to learn and get this right.
You may want to read some of the EWA threads before you go ahead and do something crazy like that. Unless all you want from them is data and not money.
Thanks for the advice. Will stay clear accordingly.
Why not split test other niches and check out which is working well?? You are on continuous loss I hope so ??
Yeah, bleeding money right now. When you say other niches – sticking to the same age/country or completely move into a different age group or even different country?
why not try international dating offers
In which networks you are currently in ??
Definitely not having the variety in offers that I need. Mainly working with Wolfstorm, C2M, and W4 right now. Also have accounts with NeverBlue, Maxbounty, A4D, and EWA (yes, saw the issues about them now!). Applied to CPATrend (actually trying to get my account moved from inactive to active). Adsimilis declined my application in summer. I asked why, but never heard back.
Adsimilis need a referrer.. check their thread… Ask some one to refer you.
Don’t spread yourself tooo thin. Lots of testing in small amounts across multiple networks makes no cashflow happen. I would recommend Adsimilis for international dating, can’t comment so much on C2M/W4/Max/A4D. Hit up Sean on the forum if you want a hand getting Adsimilis to let you in. (https://gossips.best/….php?1842-Sean)
Yes what zeno told is true… I am working on only one network right now.. when cash starts rolling… I will go with adsimilis… before that I need to find a referral
Thank you to both of you guys!!!!! I really appreciate the help. Will continue with this follow-along. Already working on some new landers and reviewing offers and potential networks to go to.
Ok, quick update to keep this follow-along alive. Reached out to some networks and some existing AMs. I am being ignored most of the time (probably because of people getting ready to travel to ASW). I have secured access to a couple of international offers and started to run the first new campaign yesterday. CTR is weak, but I managed to get 3 conversions already. I am pausing campaigns/ads once they have a good amount of clicks and impressions and the CTR stays low. Uploading new campaigns at the same time + waiting for approvals. Different country I guess calls for different images from what it looks like. I am using a landing page and I am rotating the same offer from 2 different networks.
Profit/Loss: $9.33 (Profit)
I am also working on landing pages for other countries (think Norway, Denmark, Sweden, Germany) and will get those finished through an online translation service hopefully before the end of the week. By then I hopefully have more offers to play with.
Having difficulties getting a decent CTR. Images are definitely an issue. Already retired 3 campaigns and have 6 more out there. Some ads are very slow to be approved, so this is taking a bit to get some traffic flowing. Seems like the newer ads get approved faster compared to the ones that are sitting out for 6-19 hours.
I am getting a few conversions – including those mentioned above. This might turn out good if I can get the CTR up. All conversions so far came from ads with a CTR of 0.08% or less.
I am still suffering from low CTRs. However, one campaign/ad is still doing decent with 5 conversions total and a total spent of just $15.67. The CTR for that ad is 0.064%. Definitely not satisfied, but being profitable at that level is good and motivating.
Also, volume is still low and I am increasing my bids and my budget as I go. Some ads are losers right of the bat. I have to come up with a better ad title/text combination as well. FB Ad approval is slow which just adds insult to injury. Overall I am profitable which is good. I already have 2 conversions for today, but of course the day is still young.
Here is the data for yesterday:
Profit/Loss: $8.75 (Profit)
No updates on any affiliate network related stuff. No phone calls, no emails, no Ims, nothing neither from existing AMs or from the 2 where I applied. I just hope that it is the week before ASW and that communications will pick up once ASW is over.
The offer I am running is on 2 networks that I have access to, so at least that is good.
I was testing 2 different offer pages and one is outperforming the other one by 6:1 (this includes today’s data that I will publish tomorrow). So, I switched the offer rotation to 100% going to the good offer page. This should hopefully help with making this more profitable. I am testing more images, but I don’t know. My daily spend is still very low due to very slow ad approvals and then some campaigns sitting idle even after approval. I partially had over 12 campaigns active and the budget amount exceeded my daily spent limit, but the real spent is way lower as you can see.
1 new ad seems promising and I will report about it tomorrow. Today is a lot more going on. Anyway, here is yesterday’s data:
Profit/Loss: $8.12 (Loss)
Conversions: 3 (they all happened early in the morning my time/ late in the evening for my target)
Was way too busy with the day job this week. Should have finally more time tomorrow and will continue to work on other countries and landing pages.